Talk:List of New York City Subway transfer stations

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Untitled

I know that this was a BMT to BMT connection even after Ditmas was changed to IND but I felt that it should be mentioned because the Culver shuttle history is forever tied to both stations. If you want to remove it I won't object.--Allan 20:07, 12 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Disagree on that, as it was always BMT-BMT, but I have incorporated mention of it into the Ditmas listing. --SPUI (talk) 22:33, 12 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Notes

14th-6th-7th: 1966-68 (IND-BMT), January 16, 1978 (IRT-others) [1]
Bleecker-Broadway-Lafayette: 1951-59
Canal: original? (BMT-BMT), January 16, 1978 (IRT-BMT) [2]
Chambers-Park: 1951-59
Delancey-Essex: 1951-59
Times Square-Port Authority: July 1, 1948 (IRT-BMT), 1989 (IND-others)
Bryant Park: July 1, 1968
Lexington-51st-53rd: after 1978
149th-Grand Concourse: original?
4th-9th: August 1952? [3]
Atlantic-Pacific: November 26, 1967 (Brighton-IRT), January 16, 1978 (4th-others) [4]
Franklin Avenue-Botanic Garden: October 18, 1999
Myrtle-Wyckoff: original?
New Utrecht-62nd: original?
23rd-Court Square-45th: late 1980s (IND-IND), December 16, 2001 (IRT-IND)

A 1951 map also shows free surface transfers at Marcy Avenue and Chatham Square. And of course there was the one at Rockaway Parkway. --NE2 18:43, 23 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Myrtle Avenue – Broadway

The article says: "The station remains a transfer point between the M and the J on nights and weekends."

Why on nights and weekends? Both the M and the J serve this station at all times.
Why to mention it at all? There are a lot of stations that allow transfer between different services, but none of them are listed in these tables unless these services run on different lines.
I want to move this station to the "Former transfers" below the table. Is it OK? Vcohen (talk) 15:11, 18 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It is a terminal during nights and weekends. Myrtle Ave riders must transfer here during those times. Other times, the M runs to Manhattan, so there are other stations for transfer. Acps110 ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:19, 18 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. Anyway, if I move the station to the "Former transfers" and remove the last sentence, is it OK? Vcohen (talk) 15:30, 18 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. For a passenger that rides from Middle Village to Jamaica it's still a transfer station. Vcohen (talk) 15:34, 18 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Done Vcohen (talk) 12:04, 23 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Some troubles in the lead

I see some problems in the lead of this article, but I need somebody to help me with my English to fix them.

#	The lead says	Why it isn't correct
1	The 468 stations of the New York City Subway are enumerated as they existed as part of one of the former systems.	The former systems had their own station complexes as well, such as three BMT stations at Canal Street or two IRT stations at 149th Street. We need another definition of station and complex.
2	Transfers between subway lines are ... Transfers are also available between multiple services that operate on a single line. These transfers are not included in this article, although these are also transfer stations; see List of New York City Subway stations.	Before speaking about transfers between lines, we need to say that the NYCS requires to distinguish between lines and services, and only transfers between lines are listed here. There are some prominent examples: the 145th Street station (IND 8th) has the same set of services as the 125th Street station, but the former is considered transfer station and the latter is not, because a part of the former is considered another line; the same is true for 50th Street and 42nd Street.
3	Some paper transfers between specific subway stations and bus routes also existed prior to July 4, 1997 ...	A kind of paper transfer still exists at Lexington Avenue - 63rd Street.
4	The most recently created station complex is the Court Square complex in Queens on the IND Queens Boulevard Line, IND Crosstown Line and IRT Flushing Line; opened on June 3, 2011.	This complex was not opened in 2011. It existed before and consisted of two stations. In 2011 only the third station was added. The most recently created complex is Jay Street - MetroTech.

Thanks in advance. Vcohen (talk) 16:27, 14 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Station complexes have been defined as only the 32 listed at List of New York City Subway stations#Station complexes. These are defined by the MTA's yearly ridership numbers of combined stations with unified fare control areas. A passenger can not be tracked from the fare swipe to the platform, and can't be tracked moving to different levels without passing through fare control at these complexes. In other words, only the stations that the MTA combines together in their ridership numbers are complexes. No additional information is needed, because that would only confuse. The paragraph is saying that the subway began as three separate systems, but over time has been unified into the single system of today.
Item two is already covered by a link to the list of lines in paragraph 2, and a link to the list of services in paragraph 3. By putting them in two different paragraphs, it is made clear that lines and services are not the same thing.
All paper transfers have been discontinued. The last to be discontinued was at Franklin Avenue – Fulton Street between the shuttle and IND outside of fare control. It was discontinued when the Franklin Ave Shuttle was rebuilt in the late 1990s and a passageway was built. All remaining out-of-system transfers are now handled via MetroCard.
Good point about the Jay Street complex being created after the Court Square complex. I will work on fixing that. Acps110 ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:48, 14 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you.

Both BMT Canal and IRT 149th are listed at List of New York City Subway stations#Station complexes. They were initially connected, and are still counted as separate stations. So, the current definition of stations vs. complexes as initially connected vs. not initially connected is not correct.
It isn't what I want to say. There is the following sentence: "Transfers between subway lines are..." We have to say before it what the difference is. Maybe, it's possible to list different types of transfers: transfer station vs. complex, between lines vs. between services, physical vs. paper, etc. Using this list of types we'll be able to say which types are listed in this article and which types are listed at List of New York City Subway stations#Station complexes (all types but transfers between services here, only complexes there).
OK, it's the only remaining MetroCard transfer, but the Lexington Avenue - 63rd Street station has to be mentioned here. Fixed
I see your edit. Unfortunately, Jay Street is the most recently created station complex and not the most recently created transfer station as the article claims. The Jay Street complex consists of two stations and one of them is a transfer station that became a transfer station in 1936. Fixed Vcohen (talk) 09:23, 17 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

So, if my explanation in clause 1 has been accepted, here is a draft of the very beginning of the lead that would solve both 1 and 2. It is planned to replace the first paragraph of the current lead and the first sentence of the second paragraph. The paragraph "Transfers are also available..." will be deleted.

In the New York City Subway there are several types of transfer stations: Station complex, i.e. two or more stations connected with a passageway inside fare control. The 472 stations of the New York City Subway are enumerated each station alone. When station complexes are considered to be one station each, the count of stations is 423.^[1] Station serving two or more lines. It may be a multi-level or adjacent-platform station and is considered to be one station as classified by the MTA. Typically each track in a station belongs to a certain line. Station serving two or more services. Different services may share tracks. These stations are not included in this article; see List of New York City Subway stations.^[2] Transfers are not limited to enclosed passageways. <...>
^ Both station counts (dependent on consideration of station complexes) include the one temporarily closed station: Cortlandt Street on the IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line. ^ For example, the 145th Street (IND Eighth Avenue Line) station is included, because its two levels are considered parts of two different lines, while the 125th Street (IND Eighth Avenue Line) station, serving the same set of services, is not included, because all its tracks belong to one line.

Fix my English please. Vcohen (talk) 15:52, 29 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Changed a little. Vcohen (talk) 14:00, 4 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Done Vcohen (talk) 15:18, 16 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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[1] Both station counts (dependent on consideration of station complexes) include the one temporarily closed station: Cortlandt Street on the IRT Broadway–Seventh Avenue Line.

[2] For example, the 145th Street (IND Eighth Avenue Line) station is included, because its two levels are considered parts of two different lines, while the 125th Street (IND Eighth Avenue Line) station, serving the same set of services, is not included, because all its tracks belong to one line.

[1]

[2]