Talk:Beit Jala

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[Untitled]

I am removing this from Category:Wine regions. This is because it is not a region in the sense of the other ones (administrative areas with particular winemaking regulations). I thought about creating a category for villages which make wine, but these are almost infinite. Unless they have some legal significance (eg French appelations) I dont think they are important. I have put Cremisan into Category:Wineries however. Justinc 18:08, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Category:Bethlehem

As far as I know, Beit Jala is an independent town and does not belong to Bethlehem. Therefore I revert the latest category changes. Dbach 9 July 2005 12:35 (UTC)

Beit Jala Reprisal raid.

Beit Jala reprisal raid as reported by E H Hutchison Chairman of the Mixed Armistice Commission. Ashley kennedy3 (talk) 21:05, 5 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I would appear that some people have a blatant political agenda in trying to make sure that historical events are kept unknown.Ashley kennedy3 (talk) 07:34, 7 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Quoting

Accurately report who said what.... otherwise you're only relaying POV...Ashley kennedy3 (talk) 11:10, 30 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You've got it wrong. Wikipedia is not a newspaper, and there is no need to attribute every statement in the text. That is what references are for. Please add constructively to this article. Editors with extra time on their hands are welcome to bring sources for the unsourced material in this article.--Gilabrand (talk) 11:14, 30 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Gilabrand you would be right were these events or incidents that were properly documented and verified, and were then recorded by the media. However these are allegations and claims coming from individuals, which are being reported in one newspaper, and they should be described as being exactly that. By including them here as if they were given facts, this article gives them more weight and credibility than the original newspaper article did, which is absurd. If the media are quoting someone making an allegation, that is exactly how it should be attributed here. --Nickhh (talk) 14:07, 30 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm. I've never seen the editor in question or her associates ever abiding by that system when it comes to allegations and claims against Israelis/Zionists/Jews. Apparently, it is completely legitimate to create entire articles seething with unsourced, malicious, falsified, hyped-up accusations, and "eye-witness accounts" by people who were babies when this or that "massacre" happened, as long as the "perpetrators" are "Israeli." The hypocrisy is frightening. --Gilabrand (talk) 15:18, 30 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Translation of name.

I understood that Jala is Arabic for high/highest. Could someone give an Arabic translation of the name? The Aramaic dosen't seem to reflect the local landscape! Padres Hana (talk) 16:08, 26 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know what Jala means or that the name is necessarily even Arabic. Beit means "house." In the end, "grass carpet" seems very unlikely. I'm going to remove it since it's not cited (and the supposed original Aramaic is not provided). Crushti (talk) 03:07, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I only find "house of Jala" with a suggestion that Jala comes from the word for a parapet (Survey of Western Palstine, Name Lists, p286). Zero^talk 03:33, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

This article (the part behind a paywall) says "The Palestinians are certainly praying that everything will be in place by November 27th when Bethlehem and its satellite Christian villages of Beit Jala and Beit Sahour (respectively the villages of the 'night watch' and the the 'grass carpet') will be illuminated in an official ceremony which will start the Millennium proceedings." Note that it applies 'grass carpet' to Beit Sahour. However, our article Beit Sahour says that is the 'night watch' village. SWP says "Beit Sahur" means "the house of magicians". Confusing. Zero^talk 03:45, 26 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thomson, 1860, p. 647.

User:Al Ameer son: I´ve looked and looked for the ref. for the 1834-stuff, but cannot find it? Huldra (talk) 19:54, 25 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

1931 data

The present 1931 data, cited to E. Ray Casto; Oscar W. Dotson, gives the population as "2,732. This included 196 Muslims, 2,532 Christians, and one Jew". However, Mills, 1932, p. 35, gives the population as 2,731; 198 Muslims 2529 Christian and 1 Jew. Could someone with access to Casto et al please check what they actually write? Thanks Huldra (talk) 22:17, 25 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Check your email. I guess he is quoting a different publication that is slightly different from the final report. Zero^talk 07:17, 26 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, got it. I think I´l insert Mills as a note, then. Huldra (talk) 21:35, 26 November 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 30 August 2015

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Beit Jala resides in the State of Israel. There is disputed territory but there is no country of Palestine. The arabs who live in the disputed territories call themselves palestinian and the jews who live in the disputed territories call themselves Israeli. I refer you to the UN and to the wikipedia page State of Israel borders. Thank you. 104.173.239.219 (talk) 15:48, 30 August 2015 (UTC) Kathy Chriqui[reply]

104.173.239.219 (talk) 15:48, 30 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Completely out of the question. Zero^talk 00:50, 31 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Saint George

From Saint George#Interfaith shrine:

A tradition exists in the Holy Land of Christians going to an Eastern Orthodox shrine of St George at Beith Jala; Jews also attend the site in the belief that the prophet Elijah was buried there. This is testified to by Elizabeth Finn in 1866, where she wrote, "St. George killed the dragon in this country Palestine; and the place is shown close to Beirut (Lebanon). Many churches and convents are named after him. The church at Lydda is dedicated to St George; so is a convent near Bethlehem, and another small one just opposite the Jaffa gate, and others beside. The Arab Christians believe that St George can restore mad people to their senses, and to say a person has been sent to St. George's is equivalent to saying he has been sent to a madhouse. It is singular that the Moslem Arabs adopted this veneration for St George, and send their mad people to be cured by him, as well as the Christians, but they commonly call him El Khudder —The Green—according to their favourite manner of using epithets instead of names. Why he should be called green, however, I cannot tell—unless it is from the colour of his horse. Gray horses are called green in Arabic."^[1] A possible explanation for this colour reference is Al Khidr, the erstwhile tutor of Moses, gained his name from having sat in a barren desert, turning it into a lush green paradise.^[2]^[3]

William Dalrymple, reviewing the literature in 1999, tells us that J. E. Hanauer in his 1907 book Folklore of the Holy Land: Muslim, Christian and Jewish "mentioned a shrine in the village of Beit Jala, beside Bethlehem, which at the time was frequented by Christians who regarded it as the birthplace of St. George and by Jews who regarded it as the burial place of the Prophet Elias. According to Hanauer, in his day the monastery was "a sort of madhouse. Deranged persons of all the three faiths are taken thither and chained in the court of the chapel, where they are kept for forty days on bread and water, the Eastern Orthodox priest at the head of the establishment now and then reading the Gospel over them, or administering a whipping as the case demands.'^[4] In the 1920s, according to Taufiq Canaan's Mohammedan Saints and Sanctuaries in Palestine, nothing seemed to have changed, and all three communities were still visiting the shrine and praying together."^[5]

Dalrymple himself visited the place in 1995. "I asked around in the Christian Quarter in Jerusalem, and discovered that the place was very much alive. With all the greatest shrines in the Christian world to choose from, it seemed that when the local Arab Christians had a problem – an illness, or something more complicated: a husband detained in an Israeli prison camp, for example – they preferred to seek the intercession of St George in his grubby little shrine at Beit Jala rather than praying at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem or the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem."^[5] He asked the priest at the shrine "Do you get many Muslims coming here?" The priest replied, "We get hundreds! Almost as many as the Christian pilgrims. Often, when I come in here, I find Muslims all over the floor, in the aisles, up and down."^[5]^[6]^[7]

The Encyclopædia Britannica quotes G.A. Smith in his Historic Geography of the Holy Land p. 164 saying "The Mahommedans who usually identify St. George with the prophet Elijah, at Lydda confound his legend with one about Christ himself. Their name for Antichrist is Dajjal, and they have a tradition that Jesus will slay Antichrist by the gate of Lydda. The notion sprang from an ancient bas-relief of George and the Dragon on the Lydda church. But Dajjal may be derived, by a very common confusion between n and l, from Dagon, whose name two neighbouring villages bear to this day, while one of the gates of Lydda used to be called the Gate of Dagon."^[8]

--Error (talk) 01:29, 20 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Could it be that Hanauer and Dalrymple mean Saint George's Monastery, Al-Khader in Al-Khader? --Error (talk) 11:35, 22 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Israelite period

I suggest we take this out. The Guerin reference is also to Jala, Hebron, see User:Huldra/Guerin. Huldra (talk) 20:04, 18 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, I have removed the Israelite period. Posting it below, for future reference, that is, when we make the Jala, Hebron article, Huldra (talk) 22:08, 18 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Israelite period

Although disputed, some historical geographers have identified Beit Jala with the biblical Giloh, mentioned in the Book of Joshua (Joshua 15:51) and the Book of Samuel (2 Sam 15:12).^[9]^[10]

References

^ Elizabeth Anne Finn (1866). Home in the Holyland. London: James Nisbet and Co. pp. 46–7.
^ "al-Khadir (al-Khidr)". Encyclopedia of Islam, Second Edition. Retrieved 21 April 2012.
^ Qur'an, 18:64–65
^ Hanauer, JE (1907). "Folk-lore of the Holy Land, Moslem, Christian and Jewish". Retrieved January 18, 2007.
^ ^a ^b ^c William Dalrymple (March 15, 1999). From the Holy Mountain: a journey among the Christians of the Middle East. Owl Books.
^ "Who is Saint George?". St. George's Basilica. Retrieved January 17, 2007.
^ H. S. Haddad. ""Georgic" Cults and Saints of the Levant". Retrieved on January 18, 2007
^ Chisholm, Hugh, ed. (1911). "George, Saint". Encyclopædia Britannica. Vol. 11 (11th ed.). Cambridge University Press. p. 737.
^ Victor Guérin, Description de la Palestine, Judée, Description de la Judée, Paris 1869, p. 298; See: Guérin, Victor (1869). Description Géographique, Historique et Archéologique de la Palestine (in French). Vol. 1: Judée, pt. 3. Paris: Imprimerie nationale. Others identify Giloh with Khirbet Jala, ca. 8 km. (5 mi.) north, northwest of Hebron. See: David Noel Freedman and Allen C. Myers, Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible, Grand Rapids 2000, p. 505 (s.v. Giloh) ISBN 0-8028-2400-5
^ Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible. Wm. B. Eerdmans. 2000. p. 505. ISBN 0-8028-2400-5.

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[1] Elizabeth Anne Finn (1866). Home in the Holyland. London: James Nisbet and Co. pp. 46–7.

[al-Khadir_al-Khidr-2] "al-Khadir (al-Khidr)". Encyclopedia of Islam, Second Edition. Retrieved 21 April 2012.

[3] Qur'an, 18:64–65

[4] Hanauer, JE (1907). "Folk-lore of the Holy Land, Moslem, Christian and Jewish". Retrieved January 18, 2007.

[Dalrymple-5] William Dalrymple (March 15, 1999). From the Holy Mountain: a journey among the Christians of the Middle East. Owl Books.

[Basilica-6] "Who is Saint George?". St. George's Basilica. Retrieved January 17, 2007.

[7] H. S. Haddad. ""Georgic" Cults and Saints of the Levant". Retrieved on January 18, 2007

[8] Chisholm, Hugh, ed. (1911). "George, Saint". Encyclopædia Britannica. Vol. 11 (11th ed.). Cambridge University Press. p. 737.

[9] Victor Guérin, Description de la Palestine, Judée, Description de la Judée, Paris 1869, p. 298; See: Guérin, Victor (1869). Description Géographique, Historique et Archéologique de la Palestine (in French). Vol. 1: Judée, pt. 3. Paris: Imprimerie nationale. Others identify Giloh with Khirbet Jala, ca. 8 km. (5 mi.) north, northwest of Hebron. See: David Noel Freedman and Allen C. Myers, Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible, Grand Rapids 2000, p. 505 (s.v. Giloh) ISBN 0-8028-2400-5

[Giloh1-10] Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible. Wm. B. Eerdmans. 2000. p. 505. ISBN 0-8028-2400-5.

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